Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

CHICKEN, DUCK, PIDGEON, QUAIL, TURKEY ETC
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smoky
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Joined: Thu Oct 22, 2015 7:58 am

Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by smoky » Fri Feb 12, 2016 2:03 pm

I recently did a Captain Cook's Brined chicken on my weber kettle, and it was quite tasty. I also recently had a rotisserie chook with a herbs de provence and oil baste/marinade on it, and it was delicious. So I'm going to try the herbes de provence and oil mix myself (using the Beer Can Chicken method if that makes a difference).

My question is; do you ever brine AND apply a marinade/rub or other flavouring? It seems like most people either brine or marinade/rub. Is there a reason not do both? I'm thinking a simple brine of salt and sugar would be good for my herb roasted chicken (assuming the salt levels are kept in check). Is there a reason to do this, or will the moisture from the beer and the flavourings of the herb/oil mix (with salt) achieve the same thing as brining?


hoddo
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Re: Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by hoddo » Fri Feb 12, 2016 3:00 pm

If I am going to use a dry rub or do a baste while cooking a chook I'll brine it first, when doing a marinade i do it overnight and don't usually brine.The real question is how you do the beer can thing, at best its a gimmick at worst a health hazard. The best way to achieve the same effect is a rack to stand the chook up and a waterpan under it. If you put a beer can into the chook remember it is painted on the outside and plastic coated on the inside both will be giving of unwanted chemicals when heated. Also if the can and its contents dont come up to temp it will retard the cooking, resulting in possibly overdone outside and underdone inside, if the contents do come up to a temp hot enough to get some steam into the chook and supposedly keep it moist you have probably over cooked it. My favorite way is to cut out the backbone and flatten it out, they cook and brown more evenly

smoky
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Re: Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by smoky » Fri Feb 12, 2016 3:38 pm

I get your point re the can. It's just a cheap and easy way for me try a vertical orientation. If it works and I like it I'll go and buy one of the proper BCC stands. But my wife already thinks I've gone a little overboard after buying the weber with my chimney starter, meat thermometer, lid thermometer etc. In her mind all that you ever need to cook something on a weber is a weber and some heatbeads.

Surely the health hazards of a heated can can't be that bad? The web is littered with recipes, including from big name sites like jamieoliver.com. This article indicates that there is no issue with the plastic inside the can (although I know you shouldn't trust everything you read) https://www.cooksillustrated.com/how_to ... an-chicken

Maybe I'll wrap the outside of the can in foil to stop any dye residue coming off. Or better yet use a glass jar if I have one.

Angryman65
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Re: Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by Angryman65 » Fri Feb 12, 2016 4:55 pm

smoky wrote:But my wife already thinks I've gone a little overboard after buying the weber with my chimney starter, meat thermometer, lid thermometer etc. In her mind all that you ever need to cook something on a weber is a weber and some heatbeads.
Wives always think we've gone overboard, wait until she walks out the back and actually realises there's 5 BBQs on the deck. Replying that "I need two more so I've got a different one for every day of the week" is not always the smartest thing to do.

I've done a couple ofchooks where I've used some of the marinade ingredients in the brine and it's penetrated wellbut not overpowered. Depends on what you're looking for.

Never done a beer can chook, I'd rather split them by taking out the back bone and keeping the breasts together. Stays nice and moist and cooks quicker
Vegetarian is an old Indian word for bad hunter.

hoddo
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Location: Northwest Sydney

Re: Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by hoddo » Fri Feb 12, 2016 5:39 pm

It dosen't take long before the wives realize 1 - hubby's doing the cooking. 2 - It tastes better. This is when you buy the next bit of kit

pierre
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Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2014 10:02 am

Re: Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by pierre » Thu Feb 18, 2016 12:56 pm

smoky wrote:I recently did a Captain Cook's Brined chicken on my weber kettle, and it was quite tasty. I also recently had a rotisserie chook with a herbs de provence and oil baste/marinade on it, and it was delicious. So I'm going to try the herbes de provence and oil mix myself (using the Beer Can Chicken method if that makes a difference).

My question is; do you ever brine AND apply a marinade/rub or other flavouring? It seems like most people either brine or marinade/rub. Is there a reason not do both? I'm thinking a simple brine of salt and sugar would be good for my herb roasted chicken (assuming the salt levels are kept in check). Is there a reason to do this, or will the moisture from the beer and the flavourings of the herb/oil mix (with salt) achieve the same thing as brining?
I read somewhere that brining the chicken somehow saturates the meat and cannot absorb the marinade, that would stay on the surface only.

Davo
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Re: Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by Davo » Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:44 pm

I guess if you brine the chicken, you use dry seasonings as the flavouring, you can use flavourigs in the brine but they are very subtle.

If you want to marinate, I then suggest you don't brine it.

Brining is to place more moisture into the meat.

Cheers

Davo
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Smokey
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Re: Brining - Does this negate all other flavourings?

Post by Smokey » Tue Mar 29, 2016 6:14 pm

After brining, All you need be concerned for is surface outcome. Be it chrispy skin, Breading, Glaze, Sauce, Smoking etc.
You could further marinade but once you get into brining you soon figure out that you can use the salt to get any marinade profile into the chicken.
Marinades can get confusing due to varying salt contents. Some store bought marinades will actually brine on there own.
Such as Worcestershire, Teryaki or Soy sauce. Soaking already brined meat in those salty 2 & 3 % salt sauces will screw up your salt levels that the original process has already worked out for you. You ideally want a finished salt level in the meat of 1% or less. The Captains recipe of salt levels and brine time will give you that. If adding these flavors to a brine in the first process, which I do, one should take note of the extra salt and adjust brine time or pure salt added.
I like your forum Nick Brother Smoky :D
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