The Science of Brining

Post your recipe requests and cooking questions in this setion. Not for general discussions.
urbangriller
Posts: 9453
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:46 pm
Location: Perth WA

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by urbangriller » Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:44 am

Yep, I've got no problem with that.

Pineapple eating Caravaners! :shock: What's the world coming to? :roll: :roll:

Chris
Common Sense is so rare these days it should be a Super Power!


Commander Cody
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 8:39 pm
Location: lost in the ozone

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by Commander Cody » Thu Dec 01, 2011 11:37 am

back in the late 70s they had to take a bacon cure orf the market, it was a pineapple cure, cancer causing stuff apparently.....

so, i think that justifies Chris' fear of pineapple. don't you..??..

kevin
....up in smoke.....that's where my money goes.....

Captain Cook
Posts: 3965
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2008 11:49 am
Location: Melbourne

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by Captain Cook » Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:18 pm

Commander Cody wrote:back in the late 70s they had to take a bacon cure orf the market, it was a pineapple cure, cancer causing stuff apparently.....

so, i think that justifies Chris' fear of pineapple. don't you..??..

kevin
NO


cheers

titch
Posts: 5794
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:51 pm
Location: Sth East Melbourne

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by titch » Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:28 pm

Thanks Chris.
Kevin ,your a sook.
Cheers.
The pineapple eating Titch
Cheers
Titch

Commander Cody
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 8:39 pm
Location: lost in the ozone

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by Commander Cody » Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:09 pm

POP.....that was my pacifier (dummy ) falling out after i went... :shock: :shock: :shock:

no i'm not.....when i was little ( in high school ), my mummy said that if anyone calls me names i should get my little sister to smack 'em........
(she was only three ).........these days i rely on my youngest neice, she's only just started walking.......so you watch out........'K..!! and, and my mummy says that i am doing the right thing in giving you a warning too....... :P :P :P

hey, remember who is the comps ossifer..??..i'm gonna getcha my friend......( evil laugh ).... :twisted: :twisted:

no that was a true story about the pineapple cure, i was working for a butchers' supply co-op at the time. would i tell youes porkies.....would i.... :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

kevin
....up in smoke.....that's where my money goes.....

urbangriller
Posts: 9453
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:46 pm
Location: Perth WA

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by urbangriller » Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:55 pm

You can still get Pineapple cure...no idea if it actually has the Offensive Fruit (OF) in it, maybe it does, the OF does contain enzymes that denature proteins. Maybe it's supposed to "tenderise" as well as cure?

Chris
Common Sense is so rare these days it should be a Super Power!

titch
Posts: 5794
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:51 pm
Location: Sth East Melbourne

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by titch » Fri Dec 02, 2011 3:56 pm

Got a PM on the caravaners forum which makes the whole exercise worth it I think.
Quote.
Thanks very much for making the effort to get permission to print the "Brining" document.
We are going, this morning, to get some chicken wings and give it a try.

Name with held because it was a personal Message.
Thanks Chris.
Titch
Cheers
Titch

KRoo Killer
Posts: 61
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:41 pm

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by KRoo Killer » Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:16 pm

hey guys was planning on heading up to inskip for a fishing holiday in a month. i am taking a portable smoker up for the fish we catch (hopefully it gets plenty of use). i was thinking could i brine the fish before i smoke it in sea water? they say crab is best cooked in the water it was caught in so i thought the same rule might apply for smoking.

peteru
Posts: 487
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:16 am
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by peteru » Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:47 pm

You may want to boil that water first, just to make sure you don't grow some nasties.
____________
"Beauty lies in the hands of the beer holder."

urbangriller
Posts: 9453
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:46 pm
Location: Perth WA

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by urbangriller » Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:15 pm

Seawater is roughly the right concentration for a brine...that will work fine!

Chris
Common Sense is so rare these days it should be a Super Power!

food&fish
Posts: 798
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 5:43 pm
Location: Sunbury victoria aust

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by food&fish » Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:54 am

So to brine a chicken how much salt in say 4 liters water also do you put anything else in the water
whats a good easy rub for chicken Thanks FF

urbangriller
Posts: 9453
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:46 pm
Location: Perth WA

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by urbangriller » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:24 pm

food&fish wrote:So to brine a chicken how much salt in say 4 liters water also do you put anything else in the water
whats a good easy rub for chicken Thanks FF
1 Tab cooking salt to 1 lit water (or other liquid), add any flavour you like.

Easy rub: Salt and pepper. Add some smoked paprika and garlic powder for a "Spanish" taste, add Cumin and garlic powder for a "Mediterranean" taste.
Or go a bit more complex:

Basic Dry Rub

4 Tablespoons Sea Salt (ground medium-coarse)
3 Tablespoons Black Peppercorns (ground medium-coarse)
4 Tablespoons Brown Sugar
4 Tablespoons Sweet Paprika Powder
1 Teaspoon Cayenne Pepper
2 Teaspoons Garlic Powder
2 Teaspoons Onion Powder

Cheers
Chris
Last edited by urbangriller on Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Common Sense is so rare these days it should be a Super Power!

food&fish
Posts: 798
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 5:43 pm
Location: Sunbury victoria aust

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by food&fish » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:32 pm

Thanks picking up chicken today

Amfibius
Posts: 486
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 4:14 am
Location: Camberwell, Melbourne

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by Amfibius » Mon Apr 23, 2012 5:30 pm

food&fish wrote:So to brine a chicken how much salt in say 4 liters water also do you put anything else in the water
Normally I wouldn't bother with such a detailed discussion, but since the topic header is "the science of brining", I thought I would make a more detailed post :) To get an idea of the magnitudes of salinity involved, here are a few numbers for you.

- Normal concentration of salt in blood = 0.9% (i.e. 9gm NaCl dissolved in 1000mL water)
- Concentration of salt in food which tastes "excessively salty" = 2.5%
- Concentration of salt in seawater = 3.5%
- Target salinity for brined chicken = 1.5%.

Suppose you have a 2kg chicken and 4L of water. Let us also assume that the chicken starts of with uniform salinity of 0.9% throughout, and that it is possible to achieve uniform salinity when exposed to another solution (in practice, the salinity never equilibrates - I am only making an assumption for the purpose of this calculation). If you leave the chicken in there for a day, and assume everything equilibrates, the water and chicken will have a final salinity of 0.3%

If you salt the water so that the concentration of the brine is 8% and leave it to equilibrate, the final salinity will be 5.6% (80*4 + 9*2) / 6000 - way too salty.

If you use an 8% brine but use only 2L of water, the final salinity will be 4.45% (80*2 + 9*2) / 4000.

It should be clear that there are 4 factors that affect the final salinity of the chicken:

1. Concentration of salt in the brine,
2. Amount of time you leave the chicken in the brine, and
3. The volume of brine that you have used.
4. The rate at which salt diffuses through the chicken (this in turn is dependent on other variables, e.g. thickness of meat, whether the chicken has been cut to pieces, etc).

The third point is often something which is missed when people discuss brine recipes. This is why a brine recipe that works for me may not work for you. You choose the volume of brine you need to cover your chicken, and in your pot - and my size of chicken and shape of my pot is definitely different to yours.

The fourth point illustrates another important but frequently forgotten factor when it comes to brining. The shape and cut of the chicken matters. 2kg of sliced breast meat will brine differently to 2kg whole chicken, simply because the sliced breast meat will brine very quicly and will equilibrate, whereas a whole chicken will brine slowly and never equilibrate. I do not know the rate at which brine penetrates whole chicken. If I did, I could do a calculation and give you a formula to calculate exactly how much brine you need and how long you need to brine it for to achieve the desired final salinity. This is part of the uncertainty of brining.

As for the first two points (concentration of salt, and amount of time) - you can think of this in a similar way to cooking. Just as high heat means short cooking time - at the risk of overcooking the surface and undercooking the interior - high salt means shorter brining time at the risk of uneven brining. There is no easy way to test salinity unfortunately - if you use a salinity meter you have to somehow remove a piece of chicken and then measure it.

Having said all that, you will find a variety of brine recipes on the 'net. Heston recommends a 6% brine for 8-10 hours. I find that this brine results in juicy, tender, but underseasoned chicken. I personally prefer an 8% brine for 8 hours. I tend to use 4L of water for 2kg chicken. Again, take note of the various factors that might affect the outcome of my brine recipe to yours. What is important is that you develop your own brine recipe and stick to it.
Image Image Image

120ThingsIn20Years
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:50 am
Location: South Australia
Contact:

Re: The Science of Brining

Post by 120ThingsIn20Years » Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:59 pm

urbangriller wrote:The Brine Secret to Making Foods Better

If you could catch the process at the beginning of this third stage and replace the brine mixture with a less salty but more flavoursome version you would decrease the saltiness of the final product. This is a bit of a juggling act and there is no reliable method of predicting when the third stage begins my advice is simply to keep trying different batches, replacing the brine mixture until you find a timeframe that provides you with a flavour that you like.
Very interesting post/article.

I'm part way through my first brining, and I keep probing my chicken with a multi-metre to see if I can detect a change in resistance :)
My skills include being able to move slowly forward in time, and if I really concentrate, I can sometimes tell what I'm thinking.


Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest